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Look in the mirror and at other members. The vast majority of you are over 50 years old, male, and single; after the summer is over this place will be a grave yard and bickering will (even more so) take hold. A stagnant message board always fails.

Well, you got one part correct...I'm 51 years old. The rest of it, not so much. I've got 5 kids, the oldest of which begins college soon, a wife I'm celebrating 20 years of marriage with in August, a mortgage, 529 contributions, the associated costs of a seven person family, and one income. Needless to say, we do not have a huge discretionary spending budget!

That said, I paid for a lifetime supporter membership because I felt what I received from this site far exceeded the amount I paid...so much so that I've made subsequent contributions since then. If someone doesn't see the value in a membership, that's fine, they can continue enjoying what is available or search for alternate sources of information.

What I doubt, however, is your premise that the site will become a "graveyard" or "stagnant" after the summer ends because of the new policies. My belief is that this site will maintain its' vibrancy regardless, due to the passion for kamado cooking, sharing of knowledge and fellowship exhibited by the majority of the KG members.

Best of luck on your decision whether to remain a contributing (content, not money) KG member; but if you do decide to stay and contribute (paid membership or not) please use some discretion before making blanket and stereotypical comments about the rest of us.

39, happily married, 2 kids and a mortgage. I have learned a ton here, and I cook year round!

I realized I am on the forum between 5-60 minutes a day. Over a year, how much is that entertainment worth to you?

$25 for 2 hr movie...

45, Married 20 years, 5 kids, mortgage, single income, cook year round. This is the only social media I use, cooking is my hobby (in fact I feel obligated to cook for my family) and Kamado Guru fits the bill. I have learned more from this place in the past 4 years than the previous 20 cooking on my own and trolling google for ideas. Easily worth a little cash. The entertainment and educational value far exceed taking my family out for 1 movie or eating out 3-4 times a month and that's about the same cost of a lifetime membership!

I took my daughter out to eat at Mellow Mushroom for her birthday yesterday. The bill was $50.46. 5 of us went. That's for one meal, the average American eats out 4 times a week. I guess you could say that using Kamado Guru to learn to cook pizza means it pays for itself!!!

Truth! Preach it brutha [emoji1306]
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People have to keep in mind there's real costs inolved in running the site. It's free for us, It's far from free for John to host KG.

The cost to maintain the Invision Power board license is $120 - $220 USD or more per a year depending on the number of add-on's. A dedicated server that can handle a site with the traffic load of KG costs roughly about $1500 - $3000 or more a year. There's most likely other expenses involved.

The costs are more than what most people realize. Most website owners swallow the losses during the first 3-4 years of operation. The average forum owner looses between $2500 - $10,000 during their first 3-4 years online.

Pleass note the numbers above are estimates based on past web design projects I've worked on for other froum owners. I have no clue nor would ever ask John anything this personal. I want put some the real costs in perspective for people who may not be aware.

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I don’t have much more to add than I already have, but im glad to see that John is open to leaving this thread open. You have to let people work through the 5 stages of Loss and Grief or it will greatly backfire on you.

As a younger person who (as I mentioned) seen the forum cycle before, just realize that the internet is a very unforgiving place. Heck, people wont even pay for ‘adult’ websites or HBO, im not really sure about the reasoning behind a paid subforum about cooking platform?

Besides that a fool and his money are easily seperated.The pricing structure even exceeds Netflix or other current services.

Let the old guys keep on chiming in, since they aren't going anywhere. But as was warned before check your stats in a few months.

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Best of luck John. I have nothing but respect for you. Over the last few weeks you have mention Facebook and other media outlets, I assume to understand their business.

But just step back and realize how these businesses continue to operate in the world we are living in.

Yes men who echo what you want to hear are of no real value if you plan to come out the other end with anything to show. Ask MySpace or any of the other sites who didn't want to adapt and change.

From what I can tell your relationship with KJ changed, which has spurred alot of this discussion.

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I'm not myspace.  I'm not Facebook.  I don't look at this as a business.  It's a hobby.  It's an expensive hobby.  It's a time consuming hobby.  I don't intend to get rich or make money from running Kamadoguru.com.  I don't intend to make a profit.  It just would never happen.  I do intend to encourage folks to contribute.  By taking that stand, I have created some incentive.  I  fully expected backlash from a few members.  There will be more to come.  This is why I left this thread open.  I'll let anyone who wishes voice their complaints.  

 

If my effort here backfires and everyone walks away from  this site over this, no sweat on my part.  I would hate to see it but since this is not a profit center for me, it's also no skin off my back. 

 

Now here's my opportunity to complain:

 

What have I taken away from you of value in this process?  What are you losing in this incentive deal I have created?

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It's hard to explain but honeslty I won't look at this site the same way again.

I don't know if I could put it into words, but look at Microsoft (free windows upgrades now, Google, yahoo, foxnews, newspapers all across the country, or any other multi billion dollar business)...they have tried your aproach,then immediately dropped it with newer generations because it doesn't work.

People outside of a certain demographic will not pay for content for any period of time like they once did.

I'm not throwing shade, just being honest and asking you to look around at the places you frequent.

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Best of luck John. I have nothing but respect for you. Over the last few weeks you have mention Facebook and other media outlets, I assume to understand their business.

But just step back and realize how these businesses continue to operate in the world we are living in.

Yes men who echo what you want to hear are of no real value if you plan to come out the other end with anything to show. Ask MySpace or any of the other sites who didn't want to adapt and change.

From what I can tell your relationship with KJ changed, which has spurred alot of this discussion.

 

The pricing structure is cheaper than Netflix. It's $5 a month, cheaper if you pay longer in advance. That's half of Netflix's cost.

I don’t have much more to add than I already have, but im glad to see that John is open to leaving this thread open. You have to let people work through the 5 stages of Loss and Grief or it will greatly backfire on you.

As a younger person who (as I mentioned) seen the forum cycle before, just realize that the internet is a very unforgiving place. Heck, people wont even pay for ‘adult’ websites or HBO, im not really sure about the reasoning behind a paid subforum about cooking platform?

Besides that a fool and his money are easily seperated.The pricing structure even exceeds Netflix or other current services.

Let the old guys keep on chiming in, since they aren't going anywhere. But as was warned before check your stats in a few months.

 

As a newcomer to the forums, I think my viewpoint is a little different. I mostly viewed my 6 month subscription as a donation, rather than paying to access some subforums. I haven't really used The Cooler subforum, so I can understand how older members who posted there regularly feel as if something was taken away from them. But as a new member I see access to those forums as bonus perks for donating, rather than a punishment for not donating.

 

I don't really understand your comparison to huge tech companies. They have a majorly different focus at that scale and the users are the product. This is an entirely different thing. As a younger person myself, I'd point out that there many subscription models for things like Twitch where people can subscribe for $5 a month to support a video game player they like. Not to mention the whole concept of freemium which has taken off recently.

 

Also lot of major newspapers are doing worse than this and trying to put things behind paywalls. So I don't understand your point there.

 

Personally, I donated the $25 for a subscription because this forum already saved me $200. That's not including any of the meat I haven't ruined or cooking techniques I've learned. I wouldn't have noticed that the Pit Boss went on sale at Costco since they've been sold out around here for awhile. Because of people posting on the forum (and not in the paid sections) I was able to get a price adjustment. I decided to use a bit of that money to help keep these forums running.

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I'm not myspace. I'm not Facebook. I don't look at this as a business. It's a hobby. It's an expensive hobby. It's a time consuming hobby. I don't intend to get rich or make money from running Kamadoguru.com. I don't intend to make a profit. It just would never happen. I do intend to encourage folks to contribute. By taking that stand, I have created some incentive. I fully expected backlash from a few members. There will be more to come. This is why I left this thread open. I'll let anyone who wishes voice their complaints.

If my effort here backfires and everyone walks away from this site over this, no sweat on my part. I would hate to see it but since this is not a profit center for me, it's also no skin off my back.

Now here's my opportunity to complain:

What have I taken away from you of value in this process? What are you losing in this incentive deal I have created?

John it's a shame and I'll gladly put my flame suit on now. What I feel with those that find something like this as putting them out has more to do with today's society as a whole. It's called a Sense of Entitlement that has been perpetuated by our government and frivoulous cases that are resolved the way they are today. The up and coming generations for the most part feel they should be handed everthing without having to put in the time, dedication, hard work ethics, etc. or pay their dues.
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Best of luck John. I have nothing but respect for you. Over the last few weeks you have mention Facebook and other media outlets, I assume to understand their business.

But just step back and realize how these businesses continue to operate in the world we are living in.

Yes men who echo what you want to hear are of no real value if you plan to come out the other end with anything to show. Ask MySpace or any of the other sites who didn't want to adapt and change.

From what I can tell your relationship with KJ changed, which has spurred alot of this discussion.

The pricing structure is cheaper than Netflix. It's $5 a month, cheaper if you pay longer in advance. That's half of Netflix's cost.

I don’t have much more to add than I already have, but im glad to see that John is open to leaving this thread open. You have to let people work through the 5 stages of Loss and Grief or it will greatly backfire on you.

As a younger person who (as I mentioned) seen the forum cycle before, just realize that the internet is a very unforgiving place. Heck, people wont even pay for ‘adult’ websites or HBO, im not really sure about the reasoning behind a paid subforum about cooking platform?

Besides that a fool and his money are easily seperated.The pricing structure even exceeds Netflix or other current services.

Let the old guys keep on chiming in, since they aren't going anywhere. But as was warned before check your stats in a few months.

As a newcomer to the forums, I think my viewpoint is a little different. I mostly viewed my 6 month subscription as a donation, rather than paying to access some subforums. I haven't really used The Cooler subforum, so I can understand how older members who posted there regularly feel as if something was taken away from them. But as a new member I see access to those forums as bonus perks for donating, rather than a punishment for not donating.

I don't really understand your comparison to huge tech companies. They have a majorly different focus at that scale and the users are the product. This is an entirely different thing. As a younger person myself, I'd point out that there many subscription models for things like Twitch where people can subscribe for $5 a month to support a video game player they like. Not to mention the whole concept of freemium which has taken off recently.

Also lot of major newspapers are doing worse than this and trying to put things behind paywalls. So I don't understand your point there.

Personally, I donated the $25 for a subscription because this forum already saved me $200. That's not including any of the meat I haven't ruined or cooking techniques I've learned. I wouldn't have noticed that the Pit Boss went on sale at Costco since they've been sold out around here for awhile. Because of people posting on the forum (and not in the paid sections) I was able to get a price adjustment. I decided to use a bit of that money to help keep these forums running.

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I'm 49, been married for 25 years, I have 2 kids, a daughter starting VCU this Fall who is 18 and a 16 year old son who's a rising junior. My wife and I both work for Capital One and honestly make a comfortable living which allows me to enjoy cooking on my KJ.

 

I haven't pulled the trigger on a lifetime supporter subscription because I can't justify spending the money on the site. I do miss the subscription material that was free but not enough to pay for it. I do miss being able to like a lot of the great posts made on the site but again, not enough to pay for it.

 

Having said all of that I'm a conservative, free market capitalist who has no problem with what John has done. It doesn't matter or bother me one bit if John makes money off of this site or wants to put more and more material behind the paywall to cover expenses. It's his site and I honestly believe people should be free to do what they want and charge what they want for others to use their product.  The free market will determine the success of John's experiment, he doesn't need me chastising him on his business.

 

I honestly almost pulled the trigger on a subscription and still might. Overall I'm very happy with this site, its content, its members and its leadership. 

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Netflix is worth 32.9 billion and this site is worth what?

Sit down if you have no idea what you are talking about.

You said the subscription was costing more than Netflix, that's incorrect which is all I was pointing out. You're the one who keeps comparing this website to billion dollar companies.

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