Jump to content

Woody6868

The Dreaded Overcook!

Recommended Posts

Fairly new, but frequent user, of the KJ Classic. I am constantly overcooking things on the grill and while this seems simple, I didn't know if there's a rule of thumb or something that could be useful to avoid overcooking.

 

I cook a lot of steaks and standing rib roasts on the grill, but get them to the exact internal temp and then take them off, I let them sit and they're now officially overcooked. It's terrible, it's embarrassing and I need some help!

 

So my questions for this amazing group: 

Do you take your meat off at a certain temperature before your desired internal temp? (Say 3-5 degrees)

Do you know how much more the meat will cook after it has been removed to rest?

 

A lot of this stems from my inability to time other sides and things that aren't working on the grill, but the continuation of the meat cooking after a reverse sear and removal is really not winning me any awards with the neighborhood. 

 

Appreciate any help or thoughts to avoid this going forward! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Woody6868 said:

Do you take your meat off at a certain temperature before your desired internal temp? (Say 3-5 degrees)

 

Yes.  

 

The inside of the meat is cooked by the heat that is conducted from the exterior.  So you have a roast that is 350°F on the outside and tapering to 130°F on the inside.  The heat will continue to conduct to the center after you remove it from the heat.  That's called carryover cooking.

 

As a result, it's advisable to take the meat from the kamado (or oven) before it reaches your desired serving temperature.  So...how much before?

 

Here's what I think, based on my attempts at solving the problem you're having.  

  • If the meat item is either thin, like a steak, or cooked at low/slow temperatures,  the carryover will be about 5°F.
  • If it's either somewhat bulky or cooked at high heat, the carryover will be about 10°F.

So what about a steak (thin) but cooked at high heat?  I split the difference.

 

I don't have empirical data gathered from controlled experiments.  This is just anecdotal.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Woody, 

 

With most large cut of meat cooks, pretty much, the only thing you can really do to screw them up is to over cook them. One of the first things I would recommend is a good remote temp probe. Personally, I like the ones made by Thermoworks, and I own and use a Thermoworks Smoke. The other thing I would recommend is a high quality instant read digital thermometer, and again, personally I like the Thermoworks Thermapen. I have one and use it on most cooks. You are more likely to overcook something when you cook by time on the grill rather than internal temperature IT. However, you are correct in that the meat you are cooking will continue to cook and rise in temp after you take it off the grill. In my experience how much a cut of meat rises in temp during a post cook rest is largely determined by the temp you cooked it at. For example If you cooked a steak at 350 and pulled it when the IT was 120 deg it would rise in temp more than a steak you cooked at 250 and let rest for the same amount of time. When I cook a steak, I like it to be solidly on the low side of medium rare and I usually pull them at  115 to 120 deg. depending on how I have cooked them.  How you personally like your steak however, is all about individual preference what is good of one is not always good for the other. A technique often used by Kamado backyard chefs is the reverse sear. The easiest way to do this is to use a split zone cooking environment with a half stone deflector on one side and beneath the grate,  and a naked grate above the coals on the other side  Here is a pic of what that set up looks like in practice. 

 

The steak in this pic is sitting above a 1/2 13" deflector stone held by a spider. The corn is directly above open coals. Using this set up I gently bring the steak up to 115 and then drag it over the coals to finish with probably just a minute or two per side. 

DSC_3399.thumb.jpg.a15f68aaa84e763c362d01ed5075789d.jpg

Here is the steak finishing over the coals. 

DSC_3401.thumb.jpg.c16fec17b29cb3849c2d3d9b9ef517f2.jpg

Happy cooking, hope this helps. PS. I checked the introductions section and did not see a post from you, so please stop by there and leave a short post so all our members get to meet you. Just something simple like how long you've been cooking, on what, and stuff like that. Thanks. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Reverse sear is usually only good for really thick steaks or roasts.  I have never had an issue with an over cooked roast done reverse sear, and I usually pull it right around 120, sometimes up to 125.  I'm not that picky, so long as it's mostly nice and rosy pink.   I have made the mistake of trying a reverse sear on a steak that was too thin and it did not work out well for me.  Lesson learned.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

About 3 weeks ago I overcooked a 1.5" porterhouse steak. Some of it was due to timing of other things I was cooking, but also I tried a reverse sear. I think the next time I will just sear it as it cooks and not try a reverse sear.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Reverse is the way to go despite what others say, I’ve never had a bad experience reversing it. 

 

I cook to an internal temp of 115, rest for 8 minutes and then sear one minute a side. I see others rest after searing but I rest before. After searing the steak is ready to eat right off the grill. 

 

This is my strategy for a 1.5 inch thick steak. A thicker steak I cook to a slightly higher internal temp before I rest it. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/9/2019 at 10:38 AM, Jebber said:

Reverse is the way to go despite what others say, I’ve never had a bad experience reversing it. 

 

I cook to an internal temp of 115, rest for 8 minutes and then sear one minute a side. I see others rest after searing but I rest before. After searing the steak is ready to eat right off the grill. 

 

 

I usually do a similar process, not sure why people have such difficulty with it, maybe cooking to too high in internal temp before the sear?

 

if people only have 1 grill and it’s s kamado, not sure how you’d sear at a high temp & then drop grill temp to finish up 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for all the replies, very helpful in preparing for my next cook! 

 

I have been doing most of my steaks on a reverse sear to garner the outside char that is somewhat desired. I am using the iKamand v1 and monitor the temps fairly regularly, but think I've been mistakenly cooking the steak to my desired temperature (135) and failing to account for the carryover cooking after letting them rest for 10+ minutes as I get the rest of the meal ready. I pretty much ruined a standing rib roast doing this on Christmas and served prime rib not so rare. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, freddyjbbq said:

... if people only have 1 grill and it’s s kamado, not sure how you’d sear at a high temp & then drop grill temp to finish up 

Set up dual zones. I've taken the idea to a logical extreme. 

IMG_20190302_125119677_HDR.thumb.jpg.68aa56cf7df57f00634166380e6a533b.jpg

 

You can't see that the fire bowl divider is in place, so the entire fire is under the soapstone. The soapstone actually gets too hot with a full fuel fill. Next time, I'll try less fuel. Soapstone is still new, so I don't have a full process set.

 

I've done this arrangement with a grate in place of soapstone, with much higher temps on the cool side, as one might expect. This process uses a "1-min. on/1-min. off" cook cycle, turning every cycle. When I like the sear, I leave them in back, shut the vents and wait for the internal temperature to hit my target. 

 

I have sous vide and have tried the reverse-sear process. Not sure why, but I find the texture of the meat changes for the worse compared with "flash" cooking. Texture and aroma just don't come across in pictures. 

 

Have fun,

Frank

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, John Setzler said:

 

Just me promoting my personal dissatisfaction with reverse sear results.  I am not a fan of the process but i should really leave it alone and stop trying to promote the sear first route :)

 

No, I think you should continue to tell us your thoughts on  the best method(s).  It's most helpful when you tell us why you've arrived at that conclusion.  None of us should be reluctant to share our opinions.

 

Read Group Think, by Irving Janis.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, John Setzler said:

 

Just me promoting my personal dissatisfaction with reverse sear results.  I am not a fan of the process but i should really leave it alone and stop trying to promote the sear first route :)

 

12 minutes ago, pmillen said:

 

No, I think you should continue to tell us your thoughts on  the best method(s).  It's most helpful when you tell us why you've arrived at that conclusion.  None of us should be reluctant to share our opinions.

 

Read Group Think, by Irving Janis.

 

I agree with John. If you can, a forward sear is a better method. 

 

The sear happens with a room temp (or colder) steak. Because of that the sear doesn't  do much actual cooking. When you low-n-slow in the end there is very little if any carry over cooking. Pretty much you get what you pull it at. 

 

With that said, yes with only one kamado it's sort of hard to do but not impossible. I actually have a few posts from a few years back where you build a quick hot fire, do a fast sear then close it down a bit to a low-n-slow temp. Very doable with a ceramic Kamado not so much with an Akorn. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, fbov said:

Set up dual zones. I've taken the idea to a logical extreme. 

IMG_20190302_125119677_HDR.thumb.jpg.68aa56cf7df57f00634166380e6a533b.jpg

 

 

Let me see if I understand what's going on here.  You sear a steak on the extremely hot soapstone and then move it to the much cooler grate on the other side of the upright heat deflector?  What, then, is the "1-min. on/1-min. off cook cycle"?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...