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I’ve been using these basic whetstones that I purchased a few years ago. I believe both stones ran me under $55.00.

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They work fairly well, but are a little on the small side, so I’ve been wanting to upgrade. I had a mess of Amazon gift cards so I looked to see what I could get. The first thing I purchased for my kit was a pet food mat that will serve as my work station. If I want to sharpen in the house, I need something to contain any water or slurry from making its way onto the countertop. This is a 24” x 16” silicone mat with a ½” lip and little raised nubs to keep things from sliding around.

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Next were the stones and a holder. The Suehiro brand of whetstones seemed to have excellent reviews on both Amazon and Youtube so they are what I purchased for most of them. From left to right they are a Suehiro Cerax 320 grit,  Suehiro Cerax 1000 grit, Atoma Diamond 140 coarse flattening stone, Suehiro Rika 5000 and a Kiyayama 8000 grit finishing stone.

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This picture shows the stone holder in the middle.

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Here’s a size comparison shot between the old stones and the new stones.

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Here’s a close up picture of the Kitayama 8000 stone.

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Here’s a picture of my soaking pond with the mat rolled up next to it.

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And finally all the stones and the holder in the container.

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I just sharpened most of my knives on the old stones. I’m now going to try sharping one on the new stones to see if there is any difference. I’ll let you all know what I find out.

 

Thanks for looking.

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Der,  I look forward to following this discussion.  Am getting tired of having semi sharp knives despite having them professionally sharpened twice a year and using s steel between uses.  Part of my issue is that I thought I had found a good series of knives (Kuradori) only to have my sharpening guy tell me that they don't use good steel and will not take/hold an edge very well.

 

 

i was not aware of the differences in stone makes or qualities.  Your shared experiences will help in my figuring out “the next puzzle”.

 

Cheers,

 

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23 hours ago, Ben S said:

Very nice!  I would leave the stones out for several days to dry before packing them away in a lidded box.  The hold moisture more than most people realize. 

Thank you Ben and thanks for the tip. I do not want to leave them lying around for a few days as they would be in the way. (I don't have a workshop) I do let them dry out for a around 4 to 6 hours and then wrap them in plastic wrap so as not to soak the cardboard packaging. 

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23 hours ago, JeffieBoy said:

Der,  I look forward to following this discussion.  Am getting tired of having semi sharp knives despite having them professionally sharpened twice a year and using s steel between uses.  Part of my issue is that I thought I had found a good series of knives (Kuradori) only to have my sharpening guy tell me that they don't use good steel and will not take/hold an edge very well.

 

 

i was not aware of the differences in stone makes or qualities.  Your shared experiences will help in my figuring out “the next puzzle”.

 

Cheers,

 

Jeffie,

 

I've never heard of that brand of knifes so can't really comment to much. What type of steel do they use?

 

I have both softer German steel knives (57 HRC) and harder Japanese steel knives (SG2 - 63 HRC) and US steel (BD1N - 63 HRC). They both have their place, and depending on your cutting style, the softer steel may suit you better. I was able to get a fairly sharp edge with the old whetstones on the German steel knives and the BD1N steel knives. So far I haven't needed to sharpen the Japanese knives.

 

Great name by the way! :-D

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I think you will be surprised at the difference in sharpening quality. When I started using my 3 Sigma Power wet stones it was a big difference over the dry type stones I was using, different brand also but I can't even remember what they were.

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4 hours ago, DerHusker said:

Thank you Ben and thanks for the tip. I do not want to leave them lying around for a few days as they would be in the way. (I don't have a workshop) I do let them dry out for a around 4 to 6 hours and then wrap them in plastic wrap so as not to soak the cardboard packaging. 

Careful, you run the risk of mold or cracking.  Maybe those stones can take it.  I may have seen too many horror stories with antidotal evidence.  

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You probably done want to use the 320 unless you are fixing a major chip or doing some major re-profiling.  The 1000 can set the bevel and fix most chips.  However for thinning the 320 will be your go to workhorse.  Your German knives really can't hold an edge beyond the 1000.  You can polish above that but the softer steel will fold pretty easily.  The Japanese steel and harder super steels can hold 5000 - 8000.

 

Are you right or left handed.  You should play with 8-10 degrees on the inside bevel and more traditional 15-17 on the outside bevel for your Japanese Gyutos.  You can get crazy sharp edges with an asymmetrical bevel.  

 

BTW if you don't already have a straight razor you should get one.  You can shave off of the Kiyayama 8000 as long as you follow it with a CrOx pasted strop and then clean leather.

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8 hours ago, Ben S said:

Careful, you run the risk of mold or cracking.  Maybe those stones can take it.  I may have seen too many horror stories with antidotal evidence.  

I'll try to leave them out longer but may run into resistance from SWMBO.

 

Note: What I've been doing has worked for the cheaper stones just fine.

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7 hours ago, Family_cook said:

You probably done want to use the 320 unless you are fixing a major chip or doing some major re-profiling.  The 1000 can set the bevel and fix most chips.  However for thinning the 320 will be your go to workhorse.  Your German knives really can't hold an edge beyond the 1000.  You can polish above that but the softer steel will fold pretty easily.  The Japanese steel and harder super steels can hold 5000 - 8000.

 

Are you right or left handed.  You should play with 8-10 degrees on the inside bevel and more traditional 15-17 on the outside bevel for your Japanese Gyutos.  You can get crazy sharp edges with an asymmetrical bevel.  

 

BTW if you don't already have a straight razor you should get one.  You can shave off of the Kiyayama 8000 as long as you follow it with a CrOx pasted strop and then clean leather.

Thanks Family_cook. Yes I'm aware that the 320 is too aggressive for normal sharpening. Just thought I should have one in the arsenal.

 

I'm right handed. The Japanese knives already have a 9 to 12 degree bevel on both sides so they are already razor sharp. (Seriously! See my video below) The BD1N steel knives have a 15 degree bevel on both sides although came from the factory needing to be touched up.

 

I am thinking of getting a strop but haven't done so yet. I'll keep this thread going to update everyone with the results of my first sharpening attempt. The German knives don't need to be resharpened at this time but the BD1N knives could use some more attention.

 

http:// https://youtu.be/tTF6S255POE

 

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Der,  The Kuradori are a stored branded product offered by the Home Hardware chain up here.  They offer a whole range of Kitchen products under that name.  Some items are great quality, some not so.  While the knives feels good I am guessing they are not great and experience has proven this to me.  Most likely going to buy some Wustoff in the next few months.

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4 hours ago, JeffieBoy said:

Der,  The Kuradori are a stored branded product offered by the Home Hardware chain up here.  They offer a whole range of Kitchen products under that name.  Some items are great quality, some not so.  While the knives feels good I am guessing they are not great and experience has proven this to me.  Most likely going to buy some Wustoff in the next few months.

Wustoff's are good knives. They will be on par with my German steel Zwillings.

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I've had them for 28 year now and still use them for many tasks.

 

Not trying to talk you out of them but you might want to check out Cutlery & More's website. I just purchased two of their Nexus brand knives with the BD1N steel at 63 HRC. They are offering some of them at very reasonable prices right now. Example: This 6" cruved boning knife is going for $24.95. (Might be different up in Canada)

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After I purchase 2 of their knives and saw how they are made, I went back and purchased 5 more at these sale prices.

 

Example: This 7" Santoku is just $34.95

image.png.64a072079f3a0fa1de3d0c0e2a07bc0e.png

 

They aren't the very best quality knives you'll ever buy, but they are good quality and value for those prices.

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My buddy has a set of almost 40 yr old “4 Stars” that he bought whilst in college and working part time in a kitchen.  He is still using them every time I am at his place.  I am of the impression that todays product isn't of the same quality although I may be wrong.  

 

I will be the first to admit I know little to nothing of steel ratings and knife design.  I have had a D.H. Russell trout knife since the early seventies (a gift from my older sister who had the original belt knife model) and recently visited the factory in Nova Scotia to drop the knife off for a “spa day”.  They did a factory resharpen, polished the blade, rosewood handle and waxed the sheath and charged me something like $3.50 CAD.  If it had been the full sized first edition (approx 5yrs older), it would have been free.  LOL. I did buy a 10” full tang Chef knife while there.  I believe that it is German 4110 Stainless.  Sorry, a weak moment...  BTW a Russell is in the permanent collection of MOMA.

I will look further into those Nexus branded knives and possibly have some delivered to our time share in SC for delivery during our visit in April.  Your input is muchly appreciated!

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Wow! That trout knife is beautiful.

 

The Zwilling brand used to have a lot fewer knife series to choose from. When we purchased them, the store only had 3 choices. (Before the internet) I believe they were the Four Star, the Twin Signature and the Professional "S". We went with the Professional "S". The are very heavy duty knives and they still make them. They will last me for my lifetime and then for whoever gets them after me and after them.

 

The only thing I don't like about them (now) is that they have a full bolster. At the time, the store talked this up as a great feature. (and I didn't know any better) There are some that might feel that it is, but when I go to sharpen them on the whetstones, I have to be careful as it gets in the way. It's so much easier to sharpen my knives that don't have a full bolster. I can get all the way down to the heel and not have to worry about the bolster hitting the whetstone.

 

In the picture above they are all the Professional "S" series except the middle one. It is a Zwilling Pro series rocking Santoku. From the side it looks virtually the same as the Professional "S" knives. (except for no bolster) That is until you flip them to look at the blade thickness. Professional "S" knives are almost twice the thickness as the Pro series. Having said this, they are still thicker than most (if not all) of the stamped knives out there. I have no doubt they will also last me my lifetime.

 

As for the Nexus knives, I did like the first two I bought enough to want to buy 5 more that were on sale. If you want a knife that isn't on sale at this time, try to wait for it to go on sale. I've seen them go on sale many times. In fact, if you sign up for their email alerts, they sometimes send you special sales info just for those that get the alerts.

 

Happy shopping.

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On 1/27/2020 at 10:09 PM, DerHusker said:

Wustoff's are good knives. They will be on par with my German steel Zwillings.

29463443454_67f87a563d_c.jpg

 

I've had them for 28 year now and still use them for many tasks.

 

Not trying to talk you out of them but you might want to check out Cutlery & More's website. I just purchased two of their Nexus brand knives with the BD1N steel at 63 HRC. They are offering some of them at very reasonable prices right now. Example: This 6" cruved boning knife is going for $24.95. (Might be different up in Canada)

49265726873_9c816ae369_c.jpg

 

After I purchase 2 of their knives and saw how they are made, I went back and purchased 5 more at these sale prices.

 

Example: This 7" Santoku is just $34.95

image.png.64a072079f3a0fa1de3d0c0e2a07bc0e.png

 

They aren't the very best quality knives you'll ever buy, but they are good quality and value for those prices.

 

On 1/27/2020 at 10:09 PM, DerHusker said:

Wustoff's are good knives. They will be on par with my German steel Zwillings.

29463443454_67f87a563d_c.jpg

 

I've had them for 28 year now and still use them for many tasks.

 

Not trying to talk you out of them but you might want to check out Cutlery & More's website. I just purchased two of their Nexus brand knives with the BD1N steel at 63 HRC. They are offering some of them at very reasonable prices right now. Example: This 6" cruved boning knife is going for $24.95. (Might be different up in Canada)

49265726873_9c816ae369_c.jpg

 

After I purchase 2 of their knives and saw how they are made, I went back and purchased 5 more at these sale prices.

 

Example: This 7" Santoku is just $34.95

image.png.64a072079f3a0fa1de3d0c0e2a07bc0e.png

 

They aren't the very best quality knives you'll ever buy, but they are good quality and value for those prices.

 

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